Sailor Moon Color Correction

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ChibiBoi

Aurorae Lunares
Jan 2, 2010
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#21
Thanks everyone. Your feedback is much appreciated!

Does anyone know if proper de-interlaced versions of the 4:3 open matte movies exist online? I wanted to see how they upscale but I can't seem to remove the heavy frame blending.
I don't believe so, because I think the 4:3 movie masters were transferred from the laserdiscs which all had heavy frame blending.
 
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Zeruel84

Luna Nova
Nov 4, 2021
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#22
I don't believe so, because I think the 4:3 movie masters were transferred from the laserdiscs which all had heavy frame blending.
Damn, that sucks. I tried posting in a video restoration forum too and it seems that nothing can be done. While I'm here I might as well post this Bluray vs CC image for ep 3, it's really just so embarrassing that the left side is an official product.
 

sapphire91

Systema Solare
Jul 6, 2018
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#23
Damn, that sucks. I tried posting in a video restoration forum too and it seems that nothing can be done. While I'm here I might as well post this Bluray vs CC image for ep 3, it's really just so embarrassing that the left side is an official product.
Yeah, it sure is... Sometimes this stock footage is so bad on the remaster, red and dull. It gets worse and affects a lot more stuff later on. I mean on the dvds, same with the Usagi introduction parts. But from what I remember S and Supers are the hardest when it comes to cc. The best restaurated season overall in the dvds is R. Working on it would be a blast.
 
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snowgeisha

Luna Crescens
Jun 9, 2009
237
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Texas
#24
Damn, that sucks. I tried posting in a video restoration forum too and it seems that nothing can be done. While I'm here I might as well post this Bluray vs CC image for ep 3, it's really just so embarrassing that the left side is an official product.
Jeez.. what were they thinking with that pink hue? It can’t be a case of trying to correct their vision because even the guide books and cards released at the time didn’t have any of that in the color scheme. I wonder what made them suddenly decide Sailor Moon should be pinker.. such an odd decision.
 

sapphire91

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#25
Jeez.. what were they thinking with that pink hue? It can’t be a case of trying to correct their vision because even the guide books and cards released at the time didn’t have any of that in the color scheme. I wonder what made them suddenly decide Sailor Moon should be pinker.. such an odd decision.
It is not sudden decision, it has been like that ever since it got remastered. As far as I remember, it has been the case even on the laserdiscs., from what I have seen, although less obvious. Even the movies on blu ray now, in full hd from the film masters are kind of yellowish/greenish. It is hella hard to coolor correct Sailor Moon, if you mess up a tad bid Rei hair got from purple to blue, Usagi's hair gets greenish. There are some scenes/ whole episodes you cannot get it right no matter what you try.
 

snowgeisha

Luna Crescens
Jun 9, 2009
237
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Texas
#26
It is not sudden decision, it has been like that ever since it got remastered. As far as I remember, it has been the case even on the laserdiscs., from what I have seen, although less obvious. Even the movies on blu ray now, in full hd from the film masters are kind of yellowish/greenish. It is hella hard to coolor correct Sailor Moon, if you mess up a tad bid Rei hair got from purple to blue, Usagi's hair gets greenish. There are some scenes/ whole episodes you cannot get it right no matter what you try.
Yeah, I meant back then when they remastered it. Wonder what came over them.

I actually have the laserdiscs and while not perfect, they don’t have that pink hue like the DVDs.
 

sapphire91

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#27
Yeah, I meant back then when they remastered it. Wonder what came over them.

I actually have the laserdiscs and while not perfect, they don’t have that pink hue like the DVDs.
I think this is was some easy way out to make most colors appear correct without much effort. The amount of grain is also weird in the remaster on DVD, sure grain is nothing bad, but I have seen plenty of remaster on dvd with a lot less of it from way older shows
 
Nov 4, 2021
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#28
It is not sudden decision, it has been like that ever since it got remastered. As far as I remember, it has been the case even on the laserdiscs., from what I have seen, although less obvious. Even the movies on blu ray now, in full hd from the film masters are kind of yellowish/greenish. It is hella hard to coolor correct Sailor Moon, if you mess up a tad bid Rei hair got from purple to blue, Usagi's hair gets greenish. There are some scenes/ whole episodes you cannot get it right no matter what you try.

Interesting, I saw this image that shows that the laserdisc is a lot less pink.



Also here's a direct comparison between my cel and the same frame from the show. The contrast is way too high and the detail in his eyes is completely lost. Imagine the millions of other tiny details that would be visible in a BD release that we'll never see...
 

sapphire91

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#29

Interesting, I saw this image that shows that the laserdisc is a lot less pink.



Also here's a direct comparison between my cel and the same frame from the show. The contrast is way too high and the detail in his eyes is completely lost. Imagine the millions of other tiny details that would be visible in a BD release that we'll never see...
I still hope one day they will miraculously produce these film materials and we will see the show in all the detail we can. I just do not believe how in such a short time-frame all the film got lost as it was available in the 2000s
 
Nov 4, 2021
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#30
I still hope one day they will miraculously produce these film materials and we will see the show in all the detail we can. I just do not believe how in such a short time-frame all the film got lost as it was available in the 2000s
If Toei was willing to do so, they would have done it a decade ago when everything else was getting Bluray remasters. The fact that it's 2021 and we still don't have a true HD Sailor Moon (or Even Dragon Ball Z) bluray says that we're never getting it.
 

sapphire91

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#31
If Toei was willing to do so, they would have done it a decade ago when everything else was getting Bluray remasters. The fact that it's 2021 and we still don't have a true HD Sailor Moon (or Even Dragon Ball Z) bluray says that we're never getting it.
In any case I believe they could have done a much better job with whatever masters they have available. Just look what Dynit did with them and what you manage to do from the Italian dvds and imagine if you had these uncompressed masters.

Anyway, back to the topic. I wonder how come the episodes are usually hella pinkish/reddish, and in many cases the previews for the next episodes are bluish/greenish.
 
Nov 4, 2021
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#32
In any case I believe they could have done a much better job with whatever masters they have available. Just look what Dynit did with them and what you manage to do from the Italian dvds and imagine if you had these uncompressed masters.

Anyway, back to the topic. I wonder how come the episodes are usually hella pinkish/reddish, and in many cases the previews for the next episodes are bluish/greenish.
Maybe it's the physical film aging? I've seen something like this happen with old prints of Star Wars, where they turn super red.
 

sapphire91

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#33
Maybe it's the physical film aging? I've seen something like this happen with old prints of Star Wars, where they turn super red.
Yeah, but then some scenes are blue-ish or greenissh. And I don't know if it is just me, but have you noticed how some episodes, 23, 24, 25 come to mind are less sharp, I don't know what the right word should be to describe it.
 
Nov 4, 2021
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#34
Yeah, but then some scenes are blue-ish or greenissh. And I don't know if it is just me, but have you noticed how some episodes, 23, 24, 25 come to mind are less sharp, I don't know what the right word should be to describe it.
I don't have those episodes downloaded yet, sorry.
 
Nov 4, 2021
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#36
Slightly off-topic but do HQ rips of the lasediscs exist online at all? I'm curious if there's anything that can be done about those versions of the 4:3 movies.
 
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sapphire91

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#37
This is not color-correct (my mac is on maintenance and I will try working on it next week) but I wanted to show you guys how even if you want to remove the grain, you do not have to lose that much detail the way toei did. Sure, do not mind my colors, as this is NOT color-corrected. Both make my eyes bleed when it comes to the color nightmare, simply wanted to show you how terrible their degrain process is - it it is still grainy, but most of the detail is lost.
 
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NJ_

Gurges Ater
Oct 31, 2009
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#38
If Toei was willing to do so, they would have done it a decade ago when everything else was getting Bluray remasters. The fact that it's 2021 and we still don't have a true HD Sailor Moon (or Even Dragon Ball Z) bluray says that we're never getting it.
One of the problems here is they got into it late since they didn't start putting out TV Blu-ray sets until Galaxy Express 999's upscale in 2014 while everything else before that were a couple of movies and OVAs.....starting ironically enough with the Galaxy Express 999 movies in 2009 (which while not upscales, were infamous for the heavy DNR that was applied to them).

Another problem that I have noticed, with the exception of the original Devilman, the only shows they seem to have no issue giving proper remasters to are those that used 35mm film, this was why Mazinger Z (1972) and the original Dragon Quest Dai (1991) got better treatment.



Since DBZ was brought up, they did put out the movies a few years back ("corrections" and all) but with how they have handled their other 16mm shows lately (80s GeGeGe no Kitaro, Fist of the North Star, Goldfish Warning, etc), I can only see all 3 Dragon Ball shows get SD Blu-ray sets at this point which would kinda suck for the 8 Freeza episodes that were done on 35mm.
 
Jun 6, 2006
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#39
This is not color-correct (my mac is on maintenance and I will try working on it next week) but I wanted to show you guys how even if you want to remove the grain, you do not have to lose that much detail the way toei did. Sure, do not mind my colors, as this is NOT color-corrected. Both make my eyes bleed when it comes to the color nightmare, simply wanted to show you how terrible their degrain process is - it it is still grainy, but most of the detail is lost.
Yikes. The background on the Toei blu-ray looks like a bunch of blobs.

One of the problems here is they got into it late since they didn't start putting out TV Blu-ray sets until Galaxy Express 999's upscale in 2014 while everything else before that were a couple of movies and OVAs.....starting ironically enough with the Galaxy Express 999 movies in 2009 (which while not upscales, were infamous for the heavy DNR that was applied to them).

Another problem that I have noticed, with the exception of the original Devilman, the only shows they seem to have no issue giving proper remasters to are those that used 35mm film, this was why Mazinger Z (1972) and the original Dragon Quest Dai (1991) got better treatment.
This is such a shame. The Devilman blu-ray includes the pilot, which is in HD and it looks fantastic. The upscale is fine, but a few episodes (especially episode 2) are really dark and muddy.

I'll be heartbroken whenever they do an SD release of Honey.